Author Topic: Lexington Rifle from Kentucky That May Prove to be an Important New Find  (Read 1862 times)

Offline Tanselman

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A unsigned Lexington School rifle just sold at Morphys Auction in PA. Despite no visible barrel mark, damage, and later additions, it has a chance... even if a small one... of being a special rifle. No rifle by Lexington gunsmith Edward West has been found, despite West being a highly skilled early gunsmith, silversmith, goldsmith, and inventor of importance in early Lexington. His father, Edward Sr., was a gunsmith as were several other West relatives in Kentucky, who all came from Virginia. West descendants said West never signed his work, including guns, but an "E.W." mark on a few early silver pieces may be his stamp.

The new rifle has several fascinating details:

1. Its guard and butt plate styles suggest it was made by a Virginia-trained gunsmith, not a North Carolina-trained gunsmith like Kentucky's early Bryan gunsmiths.
2. The patchbox is a pre-War of 1812 style with rare large "Q" finial and its odd side leaves have not been seen before. It may prove to be a sheet brass box rather than the standard cast brass box which, with its odd side leaves, suggests an early, unknown gunsmith.
3. The side plate is unique on a Lexington rifle, being a military style plate suggesting manufacture before the War of 1812, or perhaps when war was becoming a possibility. 
4. Important detail... the side plate is beautifully engraved in a pattern and style not seen before, and the quality of engraving suggests a professional engraver like a silversmith with formal training. The border is high quality, and the five-petal flower is very well done: together they may provide the needed clues to determine if the gun was made by Edward West.

The side plate's engraving follows no other known pattern on a Lexington rifle, and its quality suggests a professional engraver. Fortunately, a few pieces of West's silver survive that have engraved surfaces and strong family provenances, even if unsigned. I am hoping a search of Edward West silver pieces will turn up an example with a border, or a flower head, similar to the ones on the rifle's side plate. It's a long shot for sure, but at least this rifle offers a glimmer of hope that it may prove to be the first identified Edward West rifle... which would be a HUGE discovery for early Kentucky gunmaking.

A final detail deserves comment. The original patchbox lid was lost, and a modern lid was added. A Lexington style, lozenge shaped silver inlay probably graced the original lid similar to most better Lexington rifles. It may have been saved, since an oval inlay with "refreshed" engraving was inlaid into the wrist, with a matching inlay added on the opposite side. But despite such alterations, additions, and lack of a barrel signature, a potentially fascinating story may be in this rifle's future.

Shelby Gallien








« Last Edit: May 20, 2025, 08:39:06 PM by Tanselman »

Offline rich pierce

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Unusual for me to see an engraved side plate and a patchbox with no engraving, on the same gun.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Mattox Forge

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Thank you for posting this. The rifle certainly is a well formed and beautiful one. The original patchbox must have been a wonderful piece of work if the side plate is any sort of clue.

Mike

Offline smart dog

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Hi Rich,
That side plate looks to be from a British military-style gun and the engraving looks British.  I suspect it was salvaged along with the engraving and used on the rifle.

dave 
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Offline Sequatchie Rifle

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It has very pleasing architecture. Good luck with your continued research.
"We fight not for glory, nor riches nor honors, but for freedom alone, which no good man gives up except with his life.” Declaration of Arbroath, 1320

Offline Tanselman

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This rifle has its original Lexington School patchbox, but the lid was lost and replaced with an inappropriate shape/style/hinge modern lid. Lexington rifles all had limited engraving, even less on pre-War of 1812 guns as this one is, and most just had simple border engraving, which is why the side plate is so different in form and engraving quality compared to other Lexington rifles we've seen. It may be a repurposed side plate, but it seems odd to me that just one small part of lesser importance would be repurposed, rather than more significant parts. But it makes the gun more interesting and fun to study... and a little more intriguing to viewers!

Shelby Gallien     

« Last Edit: May 20, 2025, 08:41:33 PM by Tanselman »

Offline smart dog

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Hi Shelby,
That side plate design was used on several British carbines, the pattern 1770 carbine for grenadiers, early 19th century versions of the light dragoon carbine, and several cavalry carbines and rifles.  Many date to the early 19th century.  The distance between the bolt holes could confirm some of that.

dave
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Offline Tanselman

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I agree the side plate had to be borrowed from somewhere since it is foreign to Kentucky work, with the gunsmith either using or copying an older part. I have speculated [fun to do but certainly not conclusive] that the builder did so because this rille was made for use in the War of 1812 and he wanted it to look more "military."

But the real issue here is the engraving... the professional border and flower details that I'd like to try to match with similar engraving, whether British, American, or who knows, to determine if foreign or possibly domestic, and if so, then if possibly done in Kentucky where the gun was made... while keeping my fingers crossed that it may have been done by Edward West!

Shelby Gallien
« Last Edit: May 21, 2025, 07:30:40 AM by Tanselman »

Offline bama

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The engraving on the side is English. If you enlarge the photo of the side plate and look at the flower, that is the English Rose. That Rose has been popular in English engraving for a long time and continues to be popular today.
Jim Parker

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Offline JTR

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Looks like that sideplate was borrowed lately as well,
Second pic down, https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=84859.0

John Robbins

Offline Mattox Forge

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Looks like that sideplate was borrowed lately as well,
Second pic down, https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=84859.0

While one cannot tell from the photos of the rifle, the shape of the side plate does not mean it is a recently made part.

That Mikoru is a copy of an original English pattern military pistol. The reproduction fails because of the stock shape and general finish. As far as the general shape of the brass parts go, they are fairly faithful copies of the original. That pattern side plate is found in many English military pistols.

This is an original by Tatham and Egg
https://antiquearmsandarmour.com/products/officers-flintlock-1799-pattern-light-dragoon-pistol-by-tatham-egg-sn-x3266


Many of the officer purchased pistols were just more nicely finished versions of the standard pattern pistol. Some had engraving added. I agree that the rifle has a side plate salvaged from an English military arm, probably an officer's privately purchased pistol.

Mike

Offline Tanselman

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So the side plate origin is resolved... but the engraving still intrigues me. Early Bluegrass gunsmiths from Virginia such as Edward West were trained back in Virginia when it was a colony, and they were heavily exposed to English tastes and preferences.

So the questions I still have are:

1. Could Edward West have engraved this side plate with his early colonial Virginia training while in Stafford County, VA?

2. Does anyone have an English item, or gun part, with this style border or flower they could post so I could see and compare it to the Lexington rifle's side plate?

Many thanks to all who responded so far, who enlightened me on where this size/shape military side plate came from.

Shelbhy Gallien

Offline Mattox Forge

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This English pistol has very similar engraving on the butt cap and trigger guard. It is an earlier pistol than the one the rifle's side plate came off of. The rifle side plate most likely dates from the Napoleanic period, possibly picked up over here during the War of 1812. Similar engraving styles still being used then.











https://www.ima-usa.com/products/original-british-officer-flintlock-pistol-by-king-dating-from-the-american-revolutionary-war?variant=26170636165

Mike

Offline Tanselman

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Mike,

Thank you for posting that English pistol and the good images of its engraved details. Looks like you nailed it.

Shelby Gallien

Offline bama

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Shelby, here is a modern day example of the English Rose engraving. As you can see the overall design has not changed that much. Congratulations on another nice KY rifle.

Jim Parker

"An Honest Man is worth his weight in Gold"

Offline Mattox Forge

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Shelby,

You are welcome. This is a fun examination of an artifact. I think it is a great example of how parts were reused and integrally incorporated more or less seasmlessly into a new work. The English gunsmiths did this a lot more than we think, and certainly American gunsmiths did it as a mater of course.

The side plate is specific to the hole spacing in the lock. I wounder if the lock is taken from the same English gun? The lock seems to have engraving on it similar to other English made locks I have seen.

Mike
« Last Edit: May 23, 2025, 09:55:39 PM by Tanselman »

Offline Tanselman

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Mike,

Here is a better picture of the lock. I thought it was an 1800-1810 Ketland lock, but I cannot read anything on its rusted surface. It never crossed my mind that the side plate and lock may have been together previously due to having matching bolt hole spacings on this rifle; that was enlightening for me... so I actually learned something new today despite what my wife says!

The lock looks pretty good to me, other than the top jaw screw which seems like a replacement. Your thought?

Shelby Gallien


« Last Edit: May 23, 2025, 08:40:18 AM by Tanselman »

Offline Mattox Forge

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Shelby,

Here are some photos of an English officer's fusil by Ketland with a similar sideplate and similar engraving on the lock. Ketland made a variety of grades and styles of these arms. It could very well be that elements were reused from a Ketland officer's fusil.

https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/rifles/antique-rifles---flintlock/-quot-ketland-and-co--english-officer-s-fusil--al4982--quot-.cfm?gun_id=101748558





Mike
« Last Edit: May 23, 2025, 04:47:23 PM by Mattox Forge »

Offline Tanselman

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A final thought on the lock & side plate...

Lexington rifles were notorious for using small, pistol sized locks; all better rifle makers preferred smaller Ketland locks before the War of 1812, then "kind of" switched over to pistol sized "C. Bird" locks after the war. When I say "pistol size" I mean locks 4-1/4" to 4-1/2" in length, averaging about 4-3/8", and almost never larger... unless made a good distance outside of the Lexington area.

The re-use of a matching lock & side plate set from a captured/discarded/damaged pistol now makes sense to me, and it supports the general Lexington preferences in size and quality of hardware for their better rifles. 

Shelby Gallien
« Last Edit: May 24, 2025, 01:36:02 AM by Tanselman »

Offline Mattox Forge

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The first pistol introduced with that pattern side plate was a 1756 Light Dragoon. The first ones built to the pattern were made in 1759. The side plate was used until the end of the flintlock period. The associated locks were between 5 3/16 and 5 5/16 inches long.

Mike