My J&S Hawken Build - comma breech

[HighUintas]

I'm starting a J&S Hawken build and probably biting off more than I can chew. Like.... Way more. Or at least it seems that way so far. I'm not surprised though as I've read all the statements about it being hard.

First problem is getting my parts to work for me. I went with the Griffith breech and lock from Hawken shop as I plan to do a comma style breech J&S. I'll have to modify the breech a bit but it will definitely work.

My parts arrived and while both parts seem very high quality, I am going to have to get a replacement breech from him as the hook was much too loose as it came. I could wiggle it rotationally relative to the bore axis. In my opinion that's probably the worst movement for accuracy. So I talked to him and he'll send me a breech that hasn't been fitted. The lock also seems high quality. The fit is good and all the parts that matter are polished bright. It's super smooth and while yes I think the mainspring might be a little weak it seems ok. The problem is that I ordered the cut plate to save me some time. Bad idea. It would require bending the hammer still but I think I would have to bend it in a way that would be very difficult. I think the plate cutout is also too deep and shifted forward too far. With the location of the sear bar, it would put my triggers too far back on the wrist and and I'd have to build up a lot of height on the trigger blades to reach the bar. The single set trigger I have may work better but I was considering using some Roller set triggers I picked up from Rich. Those blades would need to be modified a lot to reach in order to preserve the stock architecture in my plan.

So, yes the Griffith parts are good quality but not without issues, the same as nearly every other part supplier.

My first question while I wait on replacement parts is the order of steps of the breech and barrel for a Hawken. I couldn't find this in my searching.

Please tell me if this is correct.

1. Plan and inlet barrel
2. Fit breech to tang (before fitting breech to barrel in case I ruin breech)
3. Fit breech plug to barrel
4. File finish breech, tang, and barrel together.
6. Fix breech to tang and inlet breech and tang
7. Fit lock plate to breech bolster
8. Inlet lock then drill and tap
9. Inlet trigger
10. Drill and tap tang bolts
11. Party because I made it through the worst of it.

[Dave B]

I think every one reading this is in agreement with the order youve out lined. However......I would place this addition inbetween the barrel inlet completion and Lock inlet. I recomend the use of heavy  card stock to make an exact lock plate pattern with a tumbler hole matching perfectly with the existing locks tumbler. insert the tumbler and install the hammer on the tumbler so you can rout out the  tumbler area in the stock locks area. Just the tumbler only and line up your hammer on the nipple on your perfect inlet breach section check your plate angle to while your at it. cut out the card stock under the breach bolster till your happy with the plate postion in regards to the tail of the lockplate, slightly down or straight. I have only made 5 of these and have sworn that the next one I will do this to save my self from having to modify the hammer to get it to fit properly. Not sure how the others are doing it but it is how I will going forward. Good luck on your build.

[PEARL DRUMS]

Maybe get your ramrod hole done when you get the barrel set in. That web between is crucial for your barrel fastening. I’m no expert and far from experienced. So, take it for what it’s worth.

[whetrock]

I'm not an expert either, but in addition to what PEARL DRUMS said about the rod hole, I'd also move barrel inlet down a bit. It seems to me that it works best for me if I file the lower flats, the side flats, and all the underneath of the breach plug and tang to final filed surface before inletting. That way when you get a good fit, it will be the final fit. (If you were to file the barrel after the inlet, then, depending on how rough the barrel was and how much filing was required, you might find that the inlet ended up being more lose than you intended. )
You can file the top flats and the top of the tang, etc., at the same time as the rest, but all they need is a simple filing, until later on when you get ready to install your sights. (If you finish file the top flats, tang, etc., too early, then they will just get scratched up.)

1. Plan and inlet barrel
2. Fit breech to tang (before fitting breech to barrel in case I ruin breech)
3. Fit breech plug to barrel
4. File finish breech, tang, and barrel together.
4b. Inlet barrel
4c. Drill ramrod hole
6. Fix breech to tang and inlet breech and tang
7. Fit lock plate to breech bolster
8. Inlet lock then drill and tap
9. Inlet trigger
10. Drill and tap tang bolts
11. Party because I made it through the worst of it.

[Dave Peelgren]

Install under rib before drilling ramrod.

[whetrock]

Good catch, Dave!


1. Plan and inlet barrel
2. Fit breech to tang (before fitting breech to barrel in case I ruin breech)
3. Fit breech plug to barrel
4. File finish breech, tang, and barrel together.
4b. Inlet barrel
4c. Install under rib
4d. Drill ramrod hole
6. Fix breech to tang and inlet breech and tang
7. Fit lock plate to breech bolster
8. Inlet lock then drill and tap
9. Inlet trigger
10. Drill and tap tang bolts
11. Party because I made it through the worst of it.

[HighUintas]

Great suggestions, and thank you all.

[HighUintas]

Good catch, Dave!


1. Plan and inlet barrel
2. Fit breech to tang (before fitting breech to barrel in case I ruin breech)
3. Fit breech plug to barrel
4. File finish breech, tang, and barrel together.
4b. Inlet barrel
4c. Install under rib
4d. Drill ramrod hole
6. Fix breech to tang and inlet breech and tang
7. Fit lock plate to breech bolster
8. Inlet lock then drill and tap
9. Inlet trigger
10. Drill and tap tang bolts
11. Party because I made it through the worst of it.

Whetrock, I don't think I mentioned it in my first post, but my stock is a semi precarve from TOW. It is their STK-HS-16-M1. Inlet for barrel and RR hole drilled but no lock inlet.

I have got my barrel draw filed and sitting at the bottom of the barrel inlet, although I have not yet done any color transfer to see if there's high spots to remove. The inlet is probably too tight, so I may need to remove more wood if filing the breech//barrel/tang together doesn't remove enough metal to loosen it a bit.

[whetrock]

Whetrock, I don't think I mentioned it in my first post, but my stock is a semi precarve from TOW. It is their STK-HS-16-M1. Inlet for barrel and RR hole drilled but no lock inlet.

I have got my barrel draw filed and sitting at the bottom of the barrel inlet, although I have not yet done any color transfer to see if there's high spots to remove. The inlet is probably too tight, so I may need to remove more wood if filing the breech//barrel/tang together doesn't remove enough metal to loosen it a bit.

Oh, okay. Thanks for clarifying. Presumably they have the hole drilled in the right place to work with a particular under rib? If not, it's possible to scrape the inside of a hole to move it in an upward, downward, or lateral direction. There are posts on here about that. Just holler if you need them later.

Yeah, if you haven't yet fit and filed the plug and tang, it would be good to do that before you do any more with the barrel channel.

[HighUintas]

I received the breech assembly yesterday and started working on fitting it. They came as cast (except for plug and nipple threads) at my request.

I've got them to snap together, although it is a very light camming action that takes place, but now I'm stuck in figuring out where to remove metal from. The only two places I can't think of to get the Gap across the bottom closed up is either the top of the hook where it shows contact or the bottom of the hook where it shows contact.

If I remove metal from the hook where it shows contact, I think it might allow front to back movement of the plug. If I ever move metal from the bottom where it shows contact, I think it could do the same thing but also allow moving up and down. There is nowhere else making contact that seems like it would prevent the bottom from going in further.

Which one would be the better surface to remove metal from?