Author Topic: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn  (Read 2653 times)

Offline Tanselman

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Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« on: July 20, 2025, 07:05:36 AM »
Since this board has been slow recently, I thought I'd post a powder horn I picked up at a small Indiana estate auction. It looked like a Berks Co., PA horn to me, but I don't chase PA horns, so I contacted Art DeCamp to get his thoughts on it.

Art said it was a northern Berks County horn probably from the Fleetwood, PA area. He pointed out that what I thought was an iron remnant of a broken off staple in the spout was actually an iron pin that holds the collar in place, and that these Berks County horns used the collar for strap retention. He also said on a lot of these horns the small, integral button on the butt plug is missing, especially when made of walnut since it chips away easily... so I didn't feel too bad about this button being missing. Plug is nicely turned walnut, horn is attic condition dark and dirty, and the spout tip has a chip out of it, probably from the current plug being forced in too hard too many times. It is a small horn, about 10-1/4 inch outside curve. I wish it had been a small Tansel, but at least it tweaked my interest and was a fun purchase.


Shelby Gallien 










« Last Edit: August 03, 2025, 06:50:51 PM by Tanselman »

Offline Tim Crosby

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2025, 03:16:31 PM »
 What a find! That is a classic beauty, I like the size...well everything about it.

   Tim

Offline tunadawg

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2025, 01:12:10 PM »
A cool piece of history indeed.

Offline Robby

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2025, 02:16:10 PM »
Beautiful!!!!!!
Robby
molon labe
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Offline Bob Gerard

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2025, 03:11:50 PM »
Outstanding find. Boy it’s got stories to tell if it only could.
I had read in Swayze’s “Engraved Powder Horns” that horns were sometimes dyed green. Do you think this was the case here? (Or is the lighting creating that greenish tint?)
« Last Edit: July 25, 2025, 11:59:13 PM by Bob Gerard »

Offline Tanselman

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2025, 03:13:18 AM »
Bob,

The horn looks naturally colored to me. Any "odd" tint to it probably comes from photographing inside sitting on my desk under a desk lamp. I've had several horns, including two Tansel horns, where the butt plug was painted during their period of use... perhaps late in the period. One of those horns was by John Tansel in Kentucky with traces of dark green paint on its plug. While mostly worn off, it gives the plug an interesting look that I really like.

Shelby Gallien

Offline Joe Stein

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2025, 07:43:01 PM »
I went to one of Art Decamp's talks at Dixon's years ago and I remember that he said that a lot of horns were imported for finishing in America. They were treated with a copper solution to prevent insect damage in shipment. I think it was copper sulfate. Anyway, the copper solution dyed the horns green, just like the one you have shown here. He had at least one green horn with him. I think he also said that many Berks County horns were left green when they were finished.

Offline Tony N

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2025, 03:53:18 PM »
Wow, very nice!
Always remember 12/7/41, 9/11/01, 1/6/21

Offline 4STER01

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #8 on: August 27, 2025, 10:07:14 PM »
I too acquired a powder horn at an estate sale.  Being new to this wondered what more knowledgeable could share on its possible origin as it is different screw tip, 11 1/2 long, missing a small plug on screw tip end, slight damage in wood at that end






Offline Tanselman

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #9 on: August 27, 2025, 11:21:41 PM »
Could you show us good photos of the screw tip's open spout end, and larger opening on base end with threads? The tip looks almost new in your photos, and I'd like to see how sharp, or worn, its edges and threads are, to determine if original or a modern replacement for a lost original tip, before commenting on the horn.

Shelby Gallien

Offline 4STER01

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2025, 01:22:05 AM »
Hopefully as requested pics








Offline 4STER01

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2025, 10:27:46 PM »
Mr. Shelby Gallien, I posted the additional information pics as requested.  Best Regards

Offline Tanselman

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #12 on: September 02, 2025, 12:27:49 AM »
I am still undecided on the tip. It has a chip out of its lip, which makes it look original, but when I look at the pictures showing its spout end opening, I think I see a chamfered inside edge, rather than a worn, rounded and smooth inside edge, as should be the case if original from the stopper rubbing on it many, many times when going in and out, polishing it smooth.

The one view I'd still like to see is a clear picture of the inside threads on the large end of the removed screw tip. You showed the threads on the end of the horn body, and you can see how, when old, they get chips in them. I'd like to see if the matching female threads inside the spout tip show any wear or age dings on their high points. 

Thanks,  Shelby Gallien

Offline 4STER01

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #13 on: September 03, 2025, 10:57:20 PM »
As requested; Here are pics with a 360 view of the inside threads wear and crack






Offline Tanselman

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2025, 04:31:21 AM »
Good pictures, to verify your horn has its original screw tip. You can see the dark powder staining, and more importantly, the typical bits of damage to the old threads where small chips are broken out. Knowing the tip is original to the horn, and with its distinctive shape, and the shape of the plug with staple and small raised ring around its base, you have a nice, well-used Centre County, PA screw tip horn.

Shelby Gallien

Offline 4STER01

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #15 on: September 05, 2025, 04:27:03 AM »
Thank you.  IS it important to have an enclosure tip replicated to seal the horn.  What might that have looked like?

Offline Tanselman

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #16 on: September 05, 2025, 04:55:25 AM »
If you are referring to the small soft wood plug that was used as a stopper in the spout, there is no reason to make a new one for your horn. You have a nice original horn that has passed its prime for holding powder and being air tight, as seen in the chips in the spout threads and crack in the spout tip. Adding a modern part to an otherwise good condition, original horn adds nothing to value and might detract a bit.

In case you are wondering about the old spout plugs, almost all the originals I've seen were made of a soft wood like pine, spruce, cedar, and a majority of original ones appear to be cedar. It was easy to carve and taper/smooth into a spout plug, soft enough to shape itself inside the spout over time for a snug fit, and not so hard it would eventually split the spout from repetitive use. Most old plugs are probably 1.25" to 1.5" or a tad longer with a tapered lower end for insertion, and a wider, flattened outer end for grasping to pull out... often with the teeth. Most go about 5/8" +/- down into the spout.

Shelby Gallien

Offline 4STER01

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2025, 01:15:53 AM »
Thank you for tutorial, just adds to my learning.  Will leave it alone.  I have had a contemporary horn get insect damage.  Is there any care that should be given to protect preserve this horn?

Offline Tanselman

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2025, 03:06:48 AM »
Yes, break a moth ball into several pieces and put inside the horn, and no bug will bother it. Also handle it from time to time, since the oils on your hands will help preserve the surface of the horn... and don't let it get wet.

I strongly doubt you will have bug problems if you simply keep your horn dry. Seems like most horns that run into bug problems have been put away out of sight for too long, or they were stored somewhere humid or slightly damp. I have a large collection of better horns, all kept in our normal H/AC maintained home, and I have never had a bug problem in over 40 years of collecting.

Shelby Gallien
« Last Edit: September 07, 2025, 03:10:09 AM by Tanselman »

Offline whetrock

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #19 on: September 07, 2025, 07:36:56 AM »
Shelby gave you some good advice, but I wanted to add that one of the insects that eats horn is the kitchen moth, which is a small tan moth that often comes into homes by way of food that is carrying the eggs. Many people have seen them in their kitchens, but sometimes have difficulty finding the source. Usually it is an old box of cereal or meal at the back of the cupboard, within which you might find remnants of tiny spider-web-like cocoons, and sometimes the actual moths as well. These can be there even in a perfectly dry home. The moths themselves don't eat horn, but the larvae will. To stop the infestation, you of course need to get rid of the meal or whatever it is that they have infested, but it's also helpful to set traps for them, to catch any that are still around. Walmart sells pheromone-based sticky-board traps for these pest.

My most recent unpleasant experience with them was when my dad kept a bag of raw peanuts in his home office, and the moths hatched out in droves. They found their way to two horns I had made for him that were hanging on the wall. Dad likes to keep snacks out there, and this is the second time moths have damaged those same horns. Moth damage can be repaired with epoxy, colored with artist chalk to match the color of the horn, but it's a time-consuming chore. Best to keep out the moths.

Offline JSMOSBY

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #20 on: September 07, 2025, 02:41:01 PM »
Any experience or thoughts about using canola oil on a gently cleaned dry horn in that it supposedly does not putrefy, change the colors or damage the patina?

Offline whetrock

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2025, 03:23:20 PM »

Like most vegetable oils, Canola can go rancid. And as it dries it can also become sticky and make a huge mess. I wouldn't put it on anything. (I don't even like to cook with it. Gives me a stomach ache.)

I have used a super-thin coat of Truoil (gunstock finish) on new horns. Just a drop or two (literally) rubbed on with my bare fingers. It will make your fingers sticky, but don't try to do this with gloves on. You need to use your fingers. Same when applying this or any other stock finish to your gunstocks.

But as for antique horns, I don't put anything at all on my antique horns. Part of the patina is just oils and dirt (powder residue, etc.) from all the years people handled them. If you try to clean them or do anything with any liquid at all, there is a huge chance of messing up that patina.  Others may have a different opinion.

 

Offline JSMOSBY

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #22 on: September 07, 2025, 05:45:42 PM »
Perfect.  Thank you for the insight.

Offline 4STER01

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Re: Berks County Screw Tip Powder Horn
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2025, 12:35:23 AM »
Thanks all