Best calibers for hunting

[Paddlefoot]

I have seen a number of discussions on this for bigger game and noticed a few comments for squirrels but what would you sourdough woodsmen call the smallest acceptable caliber for whitetail? Best overall for them.  Not worried about Griz in the area or any of that.

[William Worth]

Each state specifies a minimum and maximum caliber.  I would be reluctant to use less then a .45 RB, but I prefer the .54.  I don't believe that here in KY we can use a RPG. 

[Paddlefoot]

It seems that quite a few states allow 40 as the smallest but I always thought it a bit light for deer. I have a 40 that shoots great but always thought of it more as a small game gun.

[Daryl]

  .45 was the original bore size I picked for my longrifle as I figured I'd hunt with it, sooner or later, deer being the quarry.  This calibre was a toss-up between my preferred preference of .50 and the .40 I really wanted on the longrifle. The longrifle how has a .40 barrel on it, but if going hunting for deer, the .45 was a 5 minute barrel change & 5 min. hunting bag change.  I now have a .50 cal Canoe gun for deer so the .40 barrel will pretty much stay on the longrifle now.

[BJH]

It would be hard to beat a .54 or a.58 for deer sized game. I like to use a larger cal ball to produce a larger exit wound and resultant blood trail. It makes a well hit deer easy to find. I have had deer, well hit , killed with small calibers (.45) that were really hard to find due to nearly non existant blood trails. We only found them by careful grid search.

[wvmtnman]

Here in WV the smallest size you can hunt deer with is a .38.  I do know one guy who has killed numerous deer with a .40 caliber and he said that every time he shot a deer with a .40 caliber he was able to find the ball still in the deer.
That same guy told me a story of a hunting trip he remembered as a kid. The event happened in the late 1930's. He was about 7 years old and went hunting with his grandfather.  His grandfather still used a halfstock WV rifle. (I believe that his grandfather bought it new in the early 1880's) His grandfather loaded up the rifle and they headed out deer hunting.  A short while later they came up on a 4 point buck eating apples.  His grandfather raised the rifle and fired.  The deer went a few yards and dropped over. 
I was able to see the rifle and the pouch. The rifle his grandfather was using was a .35 caliber and the powder measre that was still attached to the pouch strap held about 32 grains of powder.  That was enough to kill that particular deer however I don't think I would ever try that.
                                                                        Brian

[roundball]

"...the smallest acceptable caliber for whitetail?..."

"...Best overall for them..."

I think you actually asked two questions and they are different...plus you didn't put any parameters around the questions like, only deer hunting in woods where shots only average 40 yards, or you're hunting in wide open places with long distance shots, etc.

SMALLEST CALIBER
Putting aside that deer have been taken with .22 rimfires and .40cal MLs, IMO the smallest reasonable size caliber a .45cal...and at that, I think of it as the .243 of muzzleloaders...patience yto wait for a clear unobstructed heart shot with no bones involved, etc and while 100yds is certainly possible...(like the .22cal)...I think 75yds is a more appropriate line in the sand.

BEST OVERALL FOR THEM
As a general deer hunting caliber choice to cover all reasonable distances you might encounter, and wanting good mass & energy carried to long distances that might also hit large bone, IMO the .54 and .58cals should be considered.

[Randy Hedden]

Every time I see this question and the resulting answers, I never see any consideration for the average size of deer in different parts  of the country. For example, deer in northern Illinois are huge in comparison to the average size deer in some of the southern states. Seems to me a smaller size caliber might be okay for the small southern size deer and a larger size caliber for states that have bigger deer.

Fifty caliber might be the best round for northern Illinois deer, but the state says anything over .44 caliber and thousands upon thousands of northern Illinois deer have been taken with a .45 caliber. However, I would call a .58 caliber a bit of overkill for any whitetail deer.

Illinois state DNR records show that more deer are killed each year with a "bumper gun" than any muzzle loader regardless of caliber.

Randy Hedden

www.harddogrifles.com

[Paddlefoot]

Guys I left it kind of vague to get more input all around. I built a Sharon Hawken in .58 back in the late 70's to Elk hunt Idaho with. I'm sure it would kill clean just I am not sure I want to hump that much gun around the woods of GA if I can get away with less.  Looking forward to my first squirrel hunt too. I really think the .40 will be taking care of that for me.

[frontier gander]

I love the .54cal.   .45 is fun but i can not hunt with a round ball .45 in my state due to weight limits.  The .50 just barely meets the limit

[BrownBear]

In my uses there's no penalty in picking a larger caliber for "overall" uses.  I've probably killed more deer with a 54 than any other caliber, but then again  I've probably killed more snowshoe hares my 54's, too.  I've got 32's and 36's, but they're so specialized that I use them only for small game and consequently use them a lot less.  I use the 54 so much for small game because it is terrific field practice with my bigger bores.  If I had to pick an "all around" caliber for my needs right now, it would undoubtedly be a 58, the largest caliber I currently own.  My 58's haven't popped more deer and snowshoe hare than any other caliber only because I haven't owned them as long as my 54's.

Of course I'm shooting reduced loads in the larger calibers, but why not?  They're superbly accurate and do a bang up job for head shooting small game.

[long carabine]

 If you were hunting with a centerfirefire you would probably use a 270 or a 3006 correct? So why not use a 54 or a 58 cal. Bigger bullet = bigger hole. I understand not wanting to carry a heavy rifle in the woods but I want to put down what I hit. Tim

[don getz]

I can recall a story in the Pennsylvania Game News by Bob Hujsa, brother of Rich Hujsa who helps to score the guns at
Dixons.  Anyway, Bob did a story on killing a black bear here in Pa. with a 50 cal. flintlock.  A very interesting story since
I was just getting into the flintlock game...........Don

[Mike R]

This question comes up all the time and has no real single answer.  First you have to consider state laws where you are going to hunt.  Some states allow .40--a bit light  for deer IMHO [although D. Crockett supposedly killed 106 black bear with a .40 one year].  My state's minimum is .44--a bit better for deer.  My first MLing deer rifle was a .45.  Better, and arguably the best all-around whitetail deer caliber is the .50 [many would disagree and say the .54].  I know many hunters who cleanly take whitetails with the .50 rd ball. For Mulies I'd go with a .54.  Shot placement and restricting shots to reasonble ranges are keys to cleanly taking deer with any caliber round ball.  You cannot make a MLer into a modern magnum. You must hit the vitals with a good piece of lead at a reasonable velocity--and .45 or .50 will do the trick.  One friend of mine has taken countless big whitetails with his .50 Hawken and never found the balls--they pass completely through the animal at any angle.  If I remember right he uses 90 gr ffg.  Another friend uses both a .45 and a .50 at times and also has had great success.  I know his load for his .50 is 90 gr ffg.  I tend to use a little less powder in my .50 [75 gr fffg], but have a lot less experience with deer killing with that load than my friends do with theirs. I tend to pass up shots over 75 yds with my old eyes.  Like others said, a deer can be killed with a .22 [not advisable]--one of my buddies has taken a doe with a .22CB--a round that sends a 40 gr bullet out at only 725 fps MV!  He shot it in the neck/spine from a tree stand at probably under 30 yds.  Just about any MLer would be better than that!  He would think nothing of using a .40 on deer, even though it is illegal here.  He is a skilled shot [was a Marine sniper]. 

[northmn]

As Randy stated, there is a difference between a Midwestern deer and a southern deer.  I do not care how good one can shoot, a smaller caliber will screw you up sooner or later.  I have had deer take a step forward about the time the trigger was pulled and hit a little further back than I like, nor do you always get the perfect broad side shot (sometimes you think you may have it).  Also you have to consider range.  Some folks tend to shoot deer up very close and others over 50 yards.  In Minnesota where bucks commonly make the paper field dressing at 180-200+ pounds which puts them over 200 on the hoof I feel the 50 is as small as I want to use.  I also get shots in the 75 -100 yard range in fields.  The 95 grain 40 is just too light and the 45 at 130 OK up close, but a 50 or over will permit better blood trails. I have been deer hunting for over 40 years and seen them shot with about anything you can think of.   Theres no reason to mess around with inadequate calibers.  Difference between hunting and a stunt.

DP

[Paddlefoot]

Thanks all. Please don't worry that I'm not concerned about the animal or doing a "stunt". I'm just not real familiar with hunting in your end of the country and wanted to see what you all thought were the best set of compromises. Just so you know how I think on this, my favorite modern hunting gun for the Idaho mountains is a Winchester 70 featherweight that I had rebarreled and chambered in .338-06. I tend to like having a bit more than not enough. I like to shoot careful on every shot and will pass rather than wound something I might not be able to take down cleanly. Sounds like a .50 or .54 will be in the works before too long.

[omark]

in colo you can use as small as a 40 as long as it weighs 173 gr. so it has to be a 50 to use a prb.

[roundball]

I saw a couple posts somewhere about a little .40cal conical or paper patched conical that worked well in a .40cal if that's what you happened to have...was heavier of course and pretty accurate in the 1:48"...just can't remember any more details about it

[Scott Bumpus]

An old man once told me that it don't matter so much what you hit'em with, as where you hit'em with it!

[Darrin McDonal]

Well I'll tell ya, I love the .54 cal. Ive taken Illinois , Missouri deer and squirrel with it. Yes it was head shot (thank God) but I do plan on repeating it . In my opinion .54 smooth rifle is about the most handy gun you can have squirrel to deer. Patched RB off a rest will reach out to 100 yards with perfectly acceptable accuracy for deer, bear, elk.

[Roger Fisher]

Locale is Pennsylvania with her medium sized deer.  I built a .54 Jaeger more than a couple of years ago for that game!  Lately I'm suspecting that she is ferhexed since I'm having trouble getting a shot at those critters...

I do refer now to hunting from a treestand not outta the truck window.  I do recall that shooting a flinter out of a car or truck window you end up cleaning windows for a month!!!

[M Tornichio]

I believe ohio has a minimum of 38 cal. I know many have been shot around here with 40 cal. My uncle has done it many times. I personally hunt with a 54. Probably over kill, but They don't run very far afterwards. Really a person has to ask this question to himself. There are many variables, which many have already answered. size of deer, typical distance for shots, your shooting and hunting ability. I would not be afraid of hunting deer with a 40 around here. I would approach hunting the same way I do when I hunt during archery season. Get as close as possible and only take good shots that are clear. I don't know about you guys, but I have been  very close to deer when hunting on the ground around here. I can get with in 10 yards regularly. I have been able to touch deer during gun season. I would never dream of attempting hunting with a 40 cal out west though. I have seen new mexico, arizona, colorado. It would be very difficult to get close to game consistently. Game are larger.
It really comes down to being a humane concientious hunter. Know your game, hunting area and skills.
Respectfully submitted,
Marc

[roundball]

I've touched every deer I've ever shot with a muzzleloader...













 

[t.caster]

I've taken deer with .44, .45, .62 rb, and 12 ga. sluggun. I like the bigger calibers for the increased blood trail if they take off running. I've had them go 300-500 yds with the .45, but I've also dropped a 200lb buck in his tracks with the .437 ball. Depends on shot placement. With the .62 Jaeger, I've never had one go more than 100 yds. It seems to be more deadly and productive than the shotgun, simply because it is more accurate and comfortable to shoot! The short barrel also handles well in the thick woods I hunt and from a blind.
I hope to get a midwest whitetail with my .54 Beck rifle this fall/winter. Just seems like they would be lined up to get shot by that beauty, but so far they stay out of sight when I'm carrying Becky.

[Dphariss]

It depends...
Assuming *proper shot placement*....
The 45 is certainly adequate. I consider the 50 a good minimum for deer either Whitetail or Mule deer. If you hunt in the west a 54 might be better. If you hunt on a 40 or 160 acre lease in the east you might want a 62 to make it little less likely they will get off the property.
Deer can be very hard to stop. I have had them cover 200 yards when dead but didn't know it. Both 50 and 54 and the range was short both times. I could not believe the whitetail shot with the 54 could run off but she did and at high speed. Died mid leap, landed dead and slid to a stop on the snow and never wiggled.  But I have seen them go 150-200 shot with 7mm mag with chunks of lung out the exit hole...
First deer my son shot was at 40 yards+- with a 45 flint with 45 grains of FFFG. The deer went maybe 75 yards shot just over the heart. Ball did not exit.
Any of them will work. Just do not expect the deer to fold at the shot. Unless the nervous system is interrupted or shocked they are not likely to go down in their tracks no matter what they are shot with.

If you re-enact something that "fits". Most original Kentuckies with rifling top out at about 50 caliber, some are bigger many are smaller. But the 50 is a very nice caliber for deer sized animals. It will kill deer reliably about as far as you should be shooting with a RB.
But the final choice is yours. Pick the style you like and then use a caliber appropriate to the style. Some Golden age stock designs are not all that good with calibers over 50 unless the rifle is fairly heavy. Some can cause grief as 45s. At least some pre-carves. Using a 50 allows a lighter rifle than the larger calibers do. If you want a 62 or bigger you will generally be better served in building an appropriate English style rifle or a well designed German Jaeger. Over 62 it gets very important. 62s get into the realm of nasty with a stock not meant/designed to handle recoil well. So the stock design and caliber really need to be paired for best results. Recoil can get into the 375 H&H realm or even worse with the larger bores. 66 and up.

If you want a 54-58 both good choices for a heavy kentucky choose a stock design from the early American guns with fairly flat comb lines, a wide buttplate and use a c weight swamp.
A 495 ball will weigh 180 grains, the 535 about 225-230, the .615 is about 350, a .662 ball weighs 437 a 735 ball will get close to 600 IIRC. The recoil will go up in proportion, or worse, if the velocity is kept about the same. All will give good one shot kills on deer and even elk.

Picking a golden age stock design and building a light 54 or 62 can make for a very uncomfortable rifle.
Make you choice practice with the rifle and then hunt. Practice and familiarity with the rifle is more important than caliber.

For those worried about tracking the deer and blood trails etc. When broadside standing up with the legs normally placed shoot them right over the front leg 1/3 of the way down the body from the top of the shoulder. This will anchor about any deer if bone, shoulder and/or spine, is hit.
Yes its kinda  long but there is no simple answer to this. It just SEEMS simple.
Dan