How many mistakes can one make before actually getting a build right?

[BrushCountryAg03]

Today is like many I've had where I feel like I want to either just quit building or throw things around for about half an hour or the combination of both.

I sometimes find myself seriously questioning whether or not I have any business building rifles/pistols.  I got my first build pretty much right, however I've been plagued with "self-inflicted" disasters on every project since then...On the positive side, I very seldom repeat the insignificant mistakes, and almost never repeat the serious ones, but DAMNITT there's always something new going wrong!!!

I guess I'm looking for some encouragement or at least somebody who'll hopefully tell me that I'm not the only person who's ever felt this way at any point in time while building these things...

Is there such a thing as building a flawless project? 

Are you supposed to have flawless builds like the ones I've seen on my DVD's whether it's Hershel House, Mike Miller, or James Turpin after a few builds, every time, or does that just come with from years upon years of experience?

[Acer Saccharum]

Everything has flaws.

Don't try to build something flawless, it's not a good goal. You'll end up frustrated everytime you make a mistake. For me, I make them all the time, but as I build more guns, the mistakes (most of the time  ) are smaller.

I sigh, and move on.

It ain't easy, being human.

[rich pierce]

One problem is not building all the time.  When I was building more often, each step was more practiced in my head, more programmed in.

[ken]

A sign of a true craftsmen is Fixing the mistakes that are made. Some guns just seem to go together, others just want to fight you all the way!! They usually turn out the best.            Just keep at it!!! 

[wattlebuster]

Im a mistake magnet. They hunt me down. I can invent new mistakes but I just keep on building. So far all of mine have been cosmetic cause the ones I've built so far shoot great, they just look awful. Keep on building

[JohnTyg]

I'm just finishing up my first build in 40 years and if it makes you feel less discouraged, or puts things into perspective, I've made a horrendous number of mistakes here.  

Everything from ruining a fine Getz barrel (I won't say how), to bandsawing though a lock panel after inletting a barrel in a plank, to cracking a brass butt plate in a nearly completed rifle.  Architectural and carving misadventures etc..

Almost completed and still room for more screw ups (I hope not), and glad I've been stubborn (and compulsive) and haven't given up.  Most mistakes are recoverable one way or another.

Keep at it!

John

[JohnTyg]

Just want to add, use this forum and post pics if possible as you'll find the advice here valuable and you'll build a better gun.

[chuck-ia]

I could write a book on how not to do things, (from experience) chuck

[KLMoors]

Man, what Rich said is a huge problem for me. When I was a carpenter, I was able to do a lot of my job automatically. But with the gun building, jeeesh it seems I find new ways to make new mistakes on every build.

I am getting much better at not getting worked up about them though.

The other aspect is that these things are so complex in some ways, with so many subtle details, that I don't know that most folks ever get one completely "right".

[PPatch]

Whoa up there SSS… Let's use another frame, one with a different perspective. Did you suddenly and permanently lose your health; did someone close to you die; lose your income? Did the house burn down or did some commie space debris destroy your car?

Still got beer?

You will figure it out, you will have better builds and days. Frustrations suck, I know, because I make mistakes too. Remember: "AUT VIAM INVENIAM AUT FACIAM!"

dp

[Jerry V Lape]

I don't know the answer to your question.  However after my first build, which came out pretty good, I was still disappointed with myself for a couple areas I hadn't been able to resolve.  Then I went to an antique arms show and got to examine a few original guns built by some of the better known makers.  Low and behold these originals had the same problem areas I had struggled with.  Since then I have been a lot more forgiving of my mistakes and a lot more original in figuring out how to make them insignificant too.

[Chris Treichel]

Like that rule about hand tools injuring, power tools maiming... same goes for building stuff...

I find there is a direct proportion between how fast a tool is moving and how much I f... things up. 

Its in a whole nother spectrum to actually doing things right to begin with.  But I'm not going to give up yet, way to much to learn. 

[SuperCracker]

somebody who'll hopefully tell me that I'm not the only person who's ever felt this way at any point in time while building these things...

Is there such a thing as building a flawless project? 

I have an original Belgian Percussion SxS 12Ga from 1860s made by Schepers. It's a best quality gun. Gold and silver inlays, fully engraved everywhere, GORGEOUS wood clearly a gun built by a master for someone offering a blank check.

It has not one, but TWO very well hidden repairs where a mistake was made during the lock inletting.

So no. I seriously doubt it.

[Dphariss]

I always try for perfect. But when working with wood especially its not really possible .
The wood has a great deal to do with this. Simple stocks like one would find on a 1870s Sharps for example are less prone to disasters.
In relief carving you may find areas (or the whole thing) of the stock that simply will not hold the carving or sculpting planned. Pieces chip out for no apparent reason or do to the makers excesses.

As a result there are always flaws hiccups, glued in pieces. Restaining, even tattooing to get the stuff to look right.

So  if there are "difficulties" don't feel like the Lone Ranger. Only I know where the bodies are buried in any stock I make or why the carving is not done as it might have been. Perhaps because further attempts to refine it caused pieces to flake away in an anotherwise hard piece of wood that holds inlay cuts well.
AAARRGGHH. Well actually I say other things but AARRGGHH is suitable for mixed company...

Misdrilled holes in lock plates,  brass castings cracked while being worked.
Dan

[TMerkley]

I'm on build number 3.  This time a pistol.  Is it screwed up, yep, should have seen the piece of junk wood that I started with.  Just enough thickness to work with and just tall enough to get everything in.  I was told by an old gunsmith in the area.  That the trick to being a good gunsmith is knowin how to hide your mistakes.  I believe there is a lot of truth in that.  Just think, Maybe with enough mistakes that become repeatative, might become a different "School" of building.  Look at it from a positive angle. 

[pake]

I haven't made any mistakes...  but I sure have discovered a bunch of different ways how not to do stuff!   

pake

[T*O*F]

Everything has flaws.

Some people even start out with flaws, then you don't have to worry about making them, only fixing them.  I'm working on this stock now.  99.9% of people would have rejected this piece of wood.  I find it beautiful and the flaws will add to its character.  The cracks have been stabilized for 30 years and will not hurt the structural integrity of the gun.  Expect to find these flaws in the crotchwood mentioned in another post.

[TMerkley]

I wish I could post a picture of an 1815 Harper's Ferry musket with a "huge" knot right in front of the butt plate.  Amazing work and character!

[Jim Kibler]

It's not at all uncommon to find repaired defects on original work, especially English and Continental stuff.  They typically patched cracks, voids etc.  Was viewed as perfectly acceptable practice.

[Don Getz]

I have built many guns and every one had something I was unhappy with.  I would suggest you just keep on building
and learn from your mistakes...........Don

[Mark Elliott]

Take a page from the the Bob Ross school of gunmaking.   You aren't making mistakes.  They are "happy accidents".     The more of them you make, the more you learn and the better you get at hiding them.   The next thing you know,  they are calling you a master!   

[Captchee]

I don’t think in 30+ years , I have ever made  one that  I would consider  perfect .
Seems the longer you work on a project , the more  your mind finds things that are wrong  or you just don’t like .
 
a lot of times   others wont even see an issue even though you may .. When that happens , if you can , let that area be for a while . Move on to a new area .

 Past that . We all make mistakes ,  as Don Getz said ; learn from them .

 Think of each mistake that you fix , as a added tool in your experience box

[bama]

Nope no such thing as a perfect hand made anything. I once found encouragement in a statement made by one of the Master gunsmiths in our grand hobby. His statement and I quote " I would love to build one rifle that did not have glue in it". So I do not worry about building a perfect rifle, I just worry about doing my very best work and let the end results be what they are.

I find I enjoy rifle building much more when I do that. So don't beat yourself up, relax and enjoy the ride.

[mjm46@bellsouth.net]

To me the biggest part of the appeal of building longrifles is that each and every one is a unique creation. Even when you are building two "Identical" rifles they will be different enough that parts won't interchange. As a matter of fact I number my ram rod pipes so they go back into the same inlet they were  made for.

If I was able to build them perfectly every time, I think there would be no challenge and I would quickly loose interest and stop building.

[sweed]

Two Quotes from my Yacht building days:

"He who makes no mistaces, does no work!"

"It's not how badly you screw up, It's how gracefully you recover!!"