Author Topic: Bad day in the shop (Read 10772 times)

Firelock · « **on:** February 16, 2014, 10:41:25 PM »

I was drilling out the recess for me patchbox, and everything went fine for the first three holes, but on my last hole the Forsner bit kicked out of the hole and gouged the side of the stock.

I inletted a new piece of wood to patch it. I'll have to give it a day for the epoxy to set up strong enough to shape the patch and see how it looks.

I'm pretty bummed out. I was going to stain the stock dark anyway...maybe I should paint it black.

D. Taylor Sapergia · « **Reply #1 on:** February 16, 2014, 11:41:28 PM »

Boy, I feel your frustration Mike. I suspect that all of us who have introduced chisel to wood have been in predicaments that rival this one. Your patch will be there forever, but in the years to come, it will not seem so important, and might even draw a smile to your face as you remember it. So carry on, and don't worry about it. You've come to far to throw in the towel at this point.

In the future, space your bit to evenly place cavities across the length of the box, and don't try to overlap them. Once you have the cavity to depth with the Forsner bit, it is easy to remove the webs with a chisel and mallet. The bit point moved over and broke through the web into a previous hole, and that's when things went sideways. Your stock would have had to have been clamped very tightly to the drill press table to avoid this issue, with the width of web that remained.

I applaud you for having the courage to show us the mistake.

All the best....Taylor

T*O*F · « **Reply #2 on:** February 16, 2014, 11:48:12 PM »

Much easier to drill 6 smaller holes than 3 big ones. Big things cause big mistakes.

mountainman70 · « **Reply #3 on:** February 16, 2014, 11:53:43 PM »

Old saying-bad day in shop better than good day at workplace.What has already been said.Fixin our booboos is what makes for education.looking good.Dave-fixer of many booboos.Even have a rifle bearing that name.

davebozell · « **Reply #4 on:** February 17, 2014, 12:10:37 AM »

Thanks for sharing. Looks like your fix will take care of the problem. You'll be the only one who will know it's there. You probably saved several of us from making the same mistake. To me, sharing like this is one of the best parts of this forum.

caliber45 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 17, 2014, 02:37:36 AM »

Hey, Dennis -- Move this if you have to, but I feel the need to comment. This query and the previous one by the gent just starting with a Pecatonica kit, has brought out the BEST in this forum: Pro's (Acer and Taylor among them, as usual) giving good advice and in a genteel fashion that doesn't make the newcomer feel like a dolt. Anyone who's ventured into a "cartridge" firearms store at some point has encountered the exact opposite: Someone who belittles him/her, making them feel like an idiot. These class gents make a newcomer to the world of black powder feel welcome. I know; I've been there (thanks, Taylor, for the help with the lost fly situation and the Lincoln Deringer images!))

The "feel" here is gentle, helpful, supportive. You, and the other "wranglers," see to it that that continues. I appreciate both the advice and the discipline you require of us questioners/answerers. Pat on the back! High-five! Whatever. You done good! The world is rife with "snotty." You guys have avoided that. Congrats! -- paulallen, greencastle, IN.

smylee grouch · « **Reply #6 on:** February 17, 2014, 03:01:04 AM »

It looks like you used gorilla glue epoxy. I didnt know of such stuff. Have you used this before and will the stain penetrate it ? I have done simmiler things and share your greif. Good luck on the repair, it looks like you have a nice rifle in the works.

bob in the woods · « **Reply #7 on:** February 17, 2014, 03:33:03 AM »

Smaller drill bit ..chisel out the rest. And, I must say that I use a brace and bit when drilling these holes. It goes fast enough with little chance of a big boo boo

Also, I use carpenter's wood glue for wood. Usually Titebond. The repair will be stronger than the wood itself, and no possible bad repercussions as with Gorilla glue. After 39 years in the shop, I ask myself " what could happen if I slip... ?

" and then adjust accordingly

This advice is coming from someone who dropped a chisel on an almost completed guitar top some 37 years ago.

Been reaching around, and not over my work ever since.

horseman · « **Reply #8 on:** February 17, 2014, 03:48:13 AM »

Oh Mike , I feel so bad for you, man! I, to, thank you for sharing the accident with us. You showing your fix is as much a help as the rest of the lessons. Caliber 45, I agree with you totally. This is a group of great people!

Jerry V Lape · « **Reply #9 on:** February 17, 2014, 04:29:59 AM »

I just came in from applying a "correction" on my current build. Power tools are not for me. I make enough mistakes slowly with hand tools so getting a power tool near my gun would be total disaster.

Scott Bumpus · « **Reply #10 on:** February 17, 2014, 04:51:44 AM »

I would put the buttplate back on when doing this work to prevent chipping the edge of the stock. The repair will blend in better than you think, been there done that.

Jim Kibler · « **Reply #11 on:** February 17, 2014, 05:01:47 AM »

There's nothing wrong with using this sized bit. Actually It's preferred in my view and a bit the full width of the cavity was standard procedure from a historical context. With a little care, there's no problem with this practice. More even spacing of the holes may have helped avoid this. I overlap the holes, but don't push things too far. Trying to drill a thin web can be problematic.

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #12 on:** February 17, 2014, 05:06:32 AM »

Ouch, that really hurts! I'm glad I don't see blood on the stock, whew!

Now give it an overnight or two to let yourself cool down and plan the fix.

Sorry to see your project get ripped up, it's heartbreaking. This is very frustrating, but you'll get this fixed.

For small repairs, I've cut the repair area out with a vee tool, and then cut replacement splinters out of a similar grained scrap with the same vee tool. Glue and clamp in place.

homerifle · « **Reply #13 on:** February 17, 2014, 05:07:18 AM »

I would like to add that on original rifles that show a silhouette of a bit bottoming out in the box cavity. You will generally see 3 to 4 silhouettes evenly placed where a little bit of wood between one another to be chiseled out was left after the drilling process.

rsells · « **Reply #14 on:** February 17, 2014, 05:24:24 AM »

On my third rifle (Hawken) I built from scratch back in 78 I was down to drilling a pilot hole for the back screw holding the patchbox in place and for some reason the bit broke and I put a big nasty hold next to the edge of the box. Bummer!! I put the gun down on the work bench and went away disgusted and mad. I had no idea how to fix this, and it was up front so God and everybody would see it. I didn't pick it up again for nearly six months. I talked to a young man at work during lunch one day about the issue. He said that his dad built rifles and fixed BoBo's all the time. I called him and he invited me to come out for a sit down. I explained the issue and he introduced me to Brownell's Accuraglas liquid. I made an eliptical patch and glued it in place. To my amazement, it was nearly invisible to the eye when the stock was finished. No one except me and the folks I talked to ever noticed the patch. I was concerned that the patch would come out with time, but I shot the rifle for 11 years, sold it to a man in Nevada who used it for 15 years with no issues. I took it back on trade a few years and it still looks great. I borrow it back now and again to take to matches because I don't own a rifle. All will work out. I look at it as a learning experience I had, and I do grin now and again when it comes to mind.
Roger Sells

David R. Pennington · « **Reply #15 on:** February 17, 2014, 05:59:41 AM »

I'm with Jerry. I use the bit and brace. The chance for boo boos increases proportionally with the speed of the tool. I use power tools if I'm building a deck, but hand tools almost exclusively when working on longrifles.

David Rase · « **Reply #16 on:** February 17, 2014, 06:31:33 AM »

To avoid catching my spade or Forsner bit 1n the overlap, I like to drill the depth of the holes incrementally. I start by drilling all the holes maybe 1/8" to 1/4". Then I go back over them again deepening them another 1/8" or 1/4". I continue this process until I am at the depth I desire. I have found that by going back and forth you have less alignment problems then if you drill each hole full depth.
David

Dennis Glazener · « **Reply #17 on:** February 17, 2014, 08:58:46 PM »

Quote

Hey, Dennis -- Move this if you have to, but I feel the need to comment. This query and the previous one by the gent just starting with a Pecatonica kit, has brought out the BEST in this forum: Pro's (Acer and Taylor among them, as usual) giving good advice and in a genteel fashion that doesn't make the newcomer feel like a dolt. Anyone who's ventured into a "cartridge" firearms store at some point has encountered the exact opposite: Someone who belittles him/her, making them feel like an idiot. These class gents make a newcomer to the world of black powder feel welcome. I know; I've been there (thanks, Taylor, for the help with the lost fly situation and the Lincoln Deringer images!))

The "feel" here is gentle, helpful, supportive. You, and the other "wranglers," see to it that that continues. I appreciate both the advice and the discipline you require of us questioners/answerers. Pat on the back! High-five! Whatever. You done good! The world is rife with "snotty." You guys have avoided that. Congrats! -- paulallen, greencastle, IN.

Paul,
Thanks for the kind words for ALR members/mods. Yes you're are right about the the help and support many members of ALR volunteer. I like to hear feedback like that, it confirms that ALR is a place where a serious novice can come and ask questions without feeling like he is considered a complete idiot. Its great to see experienced builders taking time to encourage others to continue with their builds even after having an "oops" or two.
Dennis

t.caster · « **Reply #18 on:** February 18, 2014, 12:36:28 AM »

Quote from: David Rase on February 17, 2014, 06:31:33 AM

To avoid catching my spade or Forsner bit 1n the overlap, I like to drill the depth of the holes incrementally. I start by drilling all the holes maybe 1/8" to 1/4". Then I go back over them again deepening them another 1/8" or 1/4". I continue this process until I am at the depth I desire. I have found that by going back and forth you have less alignment problems then if you drill each hole full depth.
David

Way to go Dave! This is HUGELY IMPORTANT ADVISE for young and old builders! Make a sign and put it over your bench!

Pete G. · « **Reply #19 on:** February 18, 2014, 03:17:22 AM »

Quote from: Dennis Glazener on February 17, 2014, 08:58:46 PM

Paul,
I like to hear feedback like that, it confirms that ALR is a place where a serious novice can come and ask questions without feeling like he is considered a complete idiot. Its great to see experienced builders taking time to encourage others to continue with their builds even after having an "oops" or two.
Dennis

How about when an experienced builder feels like a complete idiot

mountainman70 · « **Reply #20 on:** February 18, 2014, 03:19:27 AM »

Pete,being a complete sumpin is not a bad thing at any age.I am good with being complete anythin.Cheers,Dave

Kermit · « **Reply #21 on:** February 18, 2014, 03:28:33 AM »

A defining element for a master in any craft is that he/she knows how to fix screw-ups. My grandfather told me that when I was 5 or 6. His language may have been more colorful.

Titebond II is fine stuff, but can leave a light colored glue line. I reach for Titebond III for darker woods because of its darker hue.

Bob Roller · « **Reply #22 on:** February 18, 2014, 03:31:07 AM »

We are NOT complete idiots.Some of us have had appendics reoved,teeth pulled
and so forth. No sir,we are not COMPLETE idiots.

Bob Roller

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #23 on:** February 18, 2014, 05:18:29 AM »

I always find some new cow pie to step in.

You're never too smart to avoid new mistakes. It's how you recover and learn that makes the difference.

The ALR is the best thing that ever happened to my gunbuilding.

Habu · « **Reply #24 on:** February 18, 2014, 06:12:21 AM »

I kind of blanched when I read the subject line here; I was always taught that "a bad day in the shop" ended with picking up your fingers, putting them in your shirt pocket, and driving to the hospital. . . . Mistakes cutting wood or metal are just part of a normal day.

News:

Author Topic: Bad day in the shop (Read 10772 times)

caliber45