When to re-harden or replace frizzen?

[Mauser06]

I have a replacement TC L&R lock on my Franken-Rifle.


I've had the lock a couple years...The frizzen is gouging where the flint strikes. It sparks but IMO not like it should...And the gouges I believe are beating up my flints.



I called L&R  and was told to send it in...They would fit a frizzen to it and properly harden it or sell me a "soft" frizzen.


To me, the gouges indicate the frizzen isn't hard enough...? 


I am not able to properly harden one...No heavy torch or anything...


I don't wanna waste their time and my money shipping them my.lock for them to say it's normal...


Any thoughts???   

[b bogart]

They have great customer service in my experience. If you can not fit AND harden one, let them do it. My.02

[Hungry Horse]

It's sometimes just as easy to get a frizzen too hard, as it is too soft. Depending on the carbon content of the frizzen. After all, the sparks you see are small pieces of your  frizzen. If your getting a nice big shower of orange sparks now, maybe just grinding the divot out of frizzen face will do the trick.

  Hungry Horse

[Mauser06]

This frizzen came on the lock...They said it should have been properly hardened and ready to use.



I don't have a ton of shots on it...I'm fairly sure last year was the first I hunted with it...I didn't do a ton of range work with it.


It sparks....Maybe I do just need to take the gouges out and see if that helps...


I was assuming the gouges are an indication of it being too soft...It's the top 1/3rd or so..Have a couple distinct gouged horizontal lines where different flints have struck it. The bottom seems fine...Scratched but not like the top.

[little joe]

Send it to L-R and give them a shot at repairing it. What can you lose besides 5 bucks for postage.Thy are very good folks to deal with.

[BOB HILL]

Send it to L-R and give them a shot at repairing it. What can you lose besides 5 bucks for postage.Thy are very good folks to deal with.
     I agree with Little Joe's advice.Send it to L&R. They will fix you up...... Bob

[Mauser06]

Thats the plan after the season....


Really, I may be over thinking it...I see the gouges but I just felt them...They aren't DEEP...And she still sparks...


Talking to them on the phone it sounds normal and they were pretty confident that all was well as long as it's sparking.  A touch of the grinder to smooth that section might be all it needs... Definitely seems to be wearing flints..

If that doesn't fix it I will send it in...


I'm used to lesser quality frizzens that do wear somewhat quickly...

[mikeyfirelock]

I'd be curious to know where the flint is hitting the frizzen.  Just a thought, you might try different sized flints ( that is lengths)  and see if they produce different results.  Has made a difference for me at times.

[Mauser06]

Ive tried lots of flints.   There's probably no issue other than visible horizontal lines on the frizzen face where the flints first impact the frizzen. Possibly the frizzen is a little softer near the top?   They are near the top 1/4 of the frizzen or so...Like I said, right where the flint impacts...And different flints have produced a couple different lines...


I just wasn't sure if those horizontal lines were a sign that the frizzen wasn't right...

[Bob Roller]

I have a replacement TC L&R lock on my Franken-Rifle.


I've had the lock a couple years...The frizzen is gouging where the flint strikes. It sparks but IMO not like it should...And the gouges I believe are beating up my flints.



I called L&R  and was told to send it in...They would fit a frizzen to it and properly harden it or sell me a "soft" frizzen.


To me, the gouges indicate the frizzen isn't hard enough...? 


I am not able to properly harden one...No heavy torch or anything...


I don't wanna waste their time and my money shipping them my.lock for them to say it's normal...


Any thoughts???

You won't be wasting time or money. Bill Cox is one of the most honest men I ever met and
he will fix your lock. If you don't have a "heavy" torch,what is the alternative??

Bob Roller

[EC121]

When you rub the frizzen does it feel like little burrs or fishhooks are pulling your skin or is it smooth?  The flint will pull up burrs on a soft frizzen.  Try tilting the flint with a piece of leather under the back of the flint to change the impact angle a bit.  This might reduce the gouging.  Since the sparks are bits of metal, enough hits in the same spot will eventually remove metal and make a gouge.  Also check the frizzen spring tension.  If it is too strong, the mainsprings on some today's locks are strong enough to shatter a flint.  Polish the nose and spring surface if it feels gritty.

[Mauser06]

Thanx Bob!   I wasn't sure if there IS a problem.  I'm still not convinced there is.  The gouges had me concerned there may been but now that others have responded and after talking to to L&R, I don't think there is an issue.




EC121, Thanx!   It feels smooth. Even where the distinct horizontal gouges are...You can hardly feel them. It's not DEEP gouges.

I've honestly never thought of using an extra piece of leather to change the angle that the flint strikes....A light bulb just went off in my head lol. That may be the best tip I've ever read!  So simple I never thought of it lol. To me, it seems like the flint strikes too squarely. I know it prefers a shorter flint   as far away from the frizzen as I can get it it seems...I think changing the angle with an extra piece of leather light be what I need...

[JCKelly]

(edited) suggestion - have you tried bevel side up vs bevel side down?

[Mauser06]

Yessir....Bevel up..Bevel down..Black English, French Amber,..Even German Agates (which it actually seems to prefer sometimes lol). Probably some others.



It sparks fine.  Heck I just killed a buck on Monday with it.    The horizontal gouges in the frizzen had me wondering if the frizzen was bad...But after feeling them they look worse than they are. They aren't really deep.  Just a distinct line from the flint striking. I think all is well with it really...

[Daryl]

Over time and a lot of shots, the first strike area of a frizzen gets grooved- how could it not?  The flint strikes and cuts steel, scraping down and heating it into virtually incandescent heat.  Strike after strike- same deal- sooner or later, they need regrinding and sometimes re-hardening, then tempering to the correct hardness.  This has been covered here many times.
Taylor just re-hardened |& tempered my L.C.Rice tuned lock's (Durs Egg) frizzen and the sparks glow & buzz right to the floor - that is, the ones that miss the pan. The sparks hitting the pan, sizzle and buzz around in the pan. Ignition is very good - btw - much better than when that lock was new.

[retired fella]

I find using a Dremel gives me a bit more control.

[Mauser06]

That sounds like a good sparker Daryl!   



I think lightly grinding the gouges out will be all it needs for now...


Really wondering if L&R makes a bigger frizzen/pan on the same lock plate lol.  Looking at the L&R lock on my turkey Fowler, I wish this lock was like that!   Much bigger!   


That's OK... Before long I will have the next build on the bench and can put a better lock on it.

[Acer Saccharum]

When frizzens become deeply gouged, they should be ground smooth again. Be careful not to heat it up too much.

If your flint is sticking into the frizzen, dull sparks, or flint shattering, likely your frizzen is too soft. It can be pack hardened in charcoal and re-tempered.

Replace the frizzen only when it's too thin to grind smooth anymore, or you don't want to bother with heat treating it.