Author Topic: Original longrifle prices  (Read 7537 times)

Offline Seth Isaacson

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #25 on: November 08, 2023, 05:12:23 PM »
The good guns will most definitely sell better, but the days of the $50k to $100k rifles are gone.
Buck

If a full-stock Hawken can get to $141,000, those days aren't completely gone, and there is still time to see a resurgence in the values of the best longrifles. I know I catalogued at least a handful that sold in the $30,000-$75,000 range in the last few years.  I don't see guns with major restoration taking off in value again, but solid rifles will still be worth money, the question will be how much. What was the reasoning behind rifles going for $50,000-100,000 in the past? What drove prices that high at the time?
I am the Lead Historian/Firearms Specialist at Rock Island Auction Co., but I am here out of my own personal interests in muzzle loading and history.
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Offline jdm

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #26 on: November 08, 2023, 05:43:38 PM »


If a full-stock Hawken can get to $141,000, those days aren't completely gone, and there is still time to see a resurgence in the values of the best longrifles. I know I catalogued at least a handful that sold in the $30,000-$75,000 range in the last few years.  I don't see guns with major restoration taking off in value again, but solid rifles will still be worth money, the question will be how much. What was the reasoning behind rifles going for $50,000-100,000 in the past? What drove prices that high at the time?
[/quote]

I think prices were rising a little each year maybe  about 10%. They were being bought buy people for the love of the item the pure joy of having one.  Then the  Siirkin  debacle . I believe that was caused be investors. No that's to kind of word. Greedy men men out to make money on a  naive  uninformed person. One guy was buying a rifle for say ten grand selling it for twenty to the go between who dropped  it on the naive collector for thirty. In my opinion that started the ball rolling bringing the price of the lesser value longrifles up. A $3000,00 rifle  instead of going up maybe &500. was all of a sudden bringing $2000.00 more.  I would guess some of the folks who bought at the high end probably lost some of there  enthusiasm and dropped out. My thoughts for what it's worth.   Oh that $141,000.  Hawken was an other uninformed buyer IMHO
« Last Edit: November 08, 2023, 05:49:36 PM by jdm »
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Offline jdm

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #27 on: November 08, 2023, 06:46:08 PM »
As long as I got started on this.   I think the collector community  for Longrifles is a lot smaller than for the other antique  firearms.  An auction with a large number of high end Kentuckey's  is to much for the market to bear all at once.  If spread out between two or three auctions they might bring more money.
 On Louies auction I think this was the case. I know of two different people who have contacted buyers from that auction and offered them a profit on there purchase.  One guy offered  $15,000. more than what was paid but didn't get the job done.   Jim
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Offline Eric Kettenburg

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #28 on: November 08, 2023, 06:59:08 PM »
Oh that $141,000.  Hawken was an other uninformed buyer IMHO

Must be more than one, though, because he didn't bid it up that high all by himself!
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Offline jdm

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #29 on: November 08, 2023, 07:18:03 PM »
Oh that $141,000.  Hawken was an other uninformed buyer IMHO
Quote

Must be more than one, though, because he didn't bid it up that high all by himself!



  I stand corrected . Two  uninformed buyers  where price was no object.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2023, 02:31:04 PM by Dennis Glazener »
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Offline JTR

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #30 on: November 08, 2023, 07:58:04 PM »

Oh that $141,000.  Hawken was an other uninformed buyer IMHO

Must be more than one, though, because he didn't bid it up that high all by himself!

[/quote]

  I stand corrected . Two  uninformed buyers  where price was no object.
[/quote]

It only takes two bucks up guys, where it's more about beating the other guy, than buying the gun.....
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Offline JH Ehlers

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #31 on: November 09, 2023, 05:44:08 PM »
I think if someone really wants something for a collection and he/she has the money they will buy it. As the older generation dies out this will also decline with muzzleloading. If younger people are not exposed to it they will not have an interest. In today's world nerf guns are more popular, very sad!
I believe only the high end pieces will hold some sort of value in the future, hope I am wrong.

Offline T.C.Albert

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #32 on: November 10, 2023, 06:42:30 PM »
Seems like when a big collection of long rifles hits the market all at once, as many are doing these days, the market suffers.Coupled with the fact that most of the well to do kids below 40 years old that I know, who could invest in a top end gun if they wanted to, seem like they’d rather spend the big money in a vintage Nintendo rather than even consider a gun of any sort. I think the market is softening substantially and will probably continue to do so. The culture is really changing.
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« Last Edit: November 10, 2023, 06:49:19 PM by T.C.Albert »
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Offline BradBrownBess

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #33 on: December 04, 2023, 04:00:17 AM »
Best thing to do in go to Ebay and buy old auction catalogs. They are dirt cheap. I have a bunch of Civil War related North South Trader, etc magazines going back to the late 80's and early 90's. I decent mid war year 1860 Colt with good cylinder scene was 3500 to 4500 not adjusted for inflation. Same gun now maybe 1500 to 1800.
KY rifles can be in a league of their own if they are the "best of the best". I bit on a 1742 Brown Bess recently that was broken in half and put back together with copper bands - BUT - every single part was correct on the musket. So it was a hard used French Indian war English military Land Pattern Musket. I dropped out at 20K and it kept going. Estimate was 6 - 8K which I thought was correct. Emotions and a rich man had to have it.

Rock Island is not hurting for business - their new TX catalog is 3 volumes 2 inch thick each. Weight about 10 lbs!!!! There are lots and lots of 6 figure items in that auction that will make those prces. But they are the "Sam Houston presentation..." type items.

I'm rather new o 20 years collecting - Everything I collect has stayed the same or increased if its "TOP GRADE". A gentleman above mentioned American Pewter - not sure what Estate sale that was but a late 1700s Pewter Tankard with a touchmark by a known maker is a 3000 - 10K piece all day long at every auction. I collect early 1700's English Pewter mugs that are engraved with "Wiggle Work" or the owners name - they are not cheap - most 500 - 1500 and they are REALLY HARD to find.

Buy what you love - love it - if you make money "GREAT!!", if you break even or lose money due to inflation or just sell for rock bottom price "that was the fee to enjoy it".

Collecting anything is NOT an investment - its NOT - no matter what anyone calls it. No item does anything but sit, no dividends, no rent, no nothing - it just sits to look at. Its a worst a gamble or addiction and at best - a hobby to enjoy.


Offline J.M.Browning

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #34 on: December 04, 2023, 05:47:11 AM »
With all things posted here subjective Im 66 guns have been part of my life since I was fifteen . I don't see young people supporting the hobby I at the present helping a friend sell his collection his immediate family has no interest . I don't see prices or interest sustainable - a gun shop 8 miles from my house I've done business with for years I've never seen his inventory of vintage English guns  so strong the prices are way down . He claims his customer base is dying from what I see prices are down Europe & USA on antique firearms .
Thank you Boone , Glass with all the contemplate I read with todays (shooter's lightly taken as such) , you keep things simple .

Offline AZshot

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #35 on: December 05, 2023, 03:47:26 PM »
BradBrownBess, thanks for the comments.  You bring up the point many are making.  That the best of the best will (may?) stay high.  But I'd like to make the big, important point that it's ONLY the best of the best.  Everything else is slipping way down in values.  In almost every area of Antiques, from Hudson Valley artwork, to Colonial furniture, to guns.  And Pewter.  I went back and looked at all the pieces I bought, I tried to get only touchmarked items, and tried to get only American.  But I was a novice (more schooled now).  So my earliest piece was a Laurent Morand charger 11 1/2" marked Lyon  "AC".  When I got home I identified it as French from 1711-1720.  So it's only worth about $170.  I paid $7, it was a VERY well advertised auction of a famous Tucson artist.  There were people coming from several states away.  They were mostly interested in the artwork...the Pewter tables were very lightly visited the first 15 min, I got my pick.  Oh, and the records showed he paid $150 for the plate, back in about 1973.  So he lost bigtime.  Here are some others I got, I've already looked up their values.  Seem WAY down from 20-40 years ago:

9 in Thomas Danforth Boardman plate with Lion touchmark and XX.  Hartford
7 7/8 Thomas Danforth with Eagle touchmark.
I also got a wiggle work creamer for $7. 

Again, this guy collected for his entire life, and had his records of where and when he bought all the pewter.  It sold this year for pennies on the dollar.





Offline J.M.Browning

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #36 on: December 06, 2023, 09:22:29 PM »
I bought a 55 gallon drum of old pewter from a customer melted it down in to alloy ingots for casting bullets geez never gave it a second thought after a Spectro gun analysis I paid $2.00 a pound . Im sure it was someones collection - Estate clean up out of a rolloff .
Thank you Boone , Glass with all the contemplate I read with todays (shooter's lightly taken as such) , you keep things simple .

Offline lexington1

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #37 on: December 07, 2023, 01:26:47 AM »
I think that a lot of the younger generation has little or no interest in antiques. My 30 year old daughter goes with me to the gun shows and she is always telling me how young she feels at these. Heck I am 61 and I feel like I drank from the fountain of youth compared to the majority of attendees. I think the best of the best sometimes comes down to older folks who have always wanted some of these pieces but through a lifetime of collecting have no more desire for anything else, except some of the top tier items. I almost feel sorry for a lot of folks who only collect for the monetary value of things. I collect, or hoard if you ask my wife, things because I enjoy their association with history in one form or another. If I bought that Beck at Bonhams auction, it would be because I thought it was pretty awesome, not because I thought it was a business investment. AKA known as why I'm not good businessman.

Offline backsplash75

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #38 on: December 07, 2023, 08:18:21 PM »
I will buck the trend here- seeing some lower prices on wood box guns like the Beck that just sold is fantastic for < 50 year old guys like me who have been priced out of Rev War era American rifles such as this, of course I'm collecting modestly because I love this stuff and not for investment purposes.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2023, 08:23:30 PM by backsplash75 »

Offline oldtravler61

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #39 on: December 09, 2023, 09:20:04 PM »
   I have really enjoyed the comments. But what I have noticed in 50 some years of buying and selling firearms of all types. A lot has to do with location of the market where you are trying to sell your item.
  In my neck of the woods their is not a real interest in Longrifles and even true collectables don't draw any serious money. Most antiques or contemporary custom guns draw less than a grand and some way less.
  For the serious collector I think their will always be a bidding price war.
  Because they want it. Price will an always will not matter to them.
  What works for people like me lol.   Is when their handed down and the
 relatives dump them for quick cash. Seen this way to often.
  At one time I tried to appraise firearms for people to help them get a fair price. It went very well for a longtime. But this new generation just doesn't care. They just want the quick buck and get rid of it.  JMPO

Offline Cory McArtor

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #40 on: December 10, 2023, 09:20:06 AM »
I will buck the trend here- seeing some lower prices on wood box guns like the Beck that just sold is fantastic for < 50 year old guys like me who have been priced out of Rev War era American rifles such as this, of course I'm collecting modestly because I love this stuff and not for investment purposes.

Agreed. As a relatively young guy (under 40) I'd love to see prices that are more affordable. I know several people my age and younger who are very interested. But we're all trying to buy houses, raise kids, etc.

Offline eastwind

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #41 on: December 10, 2023, 11:43:16 PM »
   Current prices are difficult to judge as too many variables come into play i.e. the item, sale year, dwindling buyer base – buyers too old, change of popular media, rising anti-gun culture, and all the other points made here, but don’t forget the causes within our own community.
   Add factors like the failure of the original long rifle organizations to recognize their professed mission and develop marketing plans to promote the historic value of the long rifle (beyond its membership). Example – look at how the American decoy collectors turned a $5.00 piece of wood into a $50,000. folk art collectible. Those collectors worked at getting that result back in the sixties. Most every waterside state in America now has a public decoy museum-we have 3 in Maryland. Where are the American long rifle museums?
Why did icons like Joe Kindig, Jr, Henry Kauffman, and William Renwick not join the KRA, along with museum curators and historians - shouldn’t they have been more enticed?
   And don't forget the years of Tefft forgeries and other nefarious dealer activity that turned Herman Dean, Renwick, and hundreds of others against the market for very early guns.
Until 1971 and the famous Historic Society York Show no one credible group was putting on exhibitions to the public. The KRA was just formed, but they called it an exclusive club and never invited the general public into their shows, so they never put on any public exhibitions. There was a long stretch from that York show until 2009 and (forgive me) my exhibit at the Berks County, Reading show – the first sizeable exhibit of long rifles in almost 15 years. Apparently, the American Society of Arms Collectors was never much for public exhibitions, leaving only commercial gun shows as the source for the public’s appreciation of the long rifle.
   But if you think the market is still OK, look at the current Rock Island auction results. What appeared to be a decent Haga-attributed rifle went for $17,000. I picked this rifle because this period and particular style of rifle has very much in common with every other Haga attribution sold in recent years. Ten years ago, one very similar sold for $55,000. at the Baltimore Show. Flayderman sold one for $35,000. and another for $27,000. from his catalog, I sold one for $44,000. about the same time. Then there is the Simon Miller rifle, another of his basic designs that just sold for $4,250., three have sold in the previous five-six years - one for $12,000., 14,000, and 15,000.
   Then look at the Winchester 76 Centennial which sold for $200,000.+ – nothing against the collectors, but where is the hand-made, early craftsmanship of great historic value? Was it simply that Winchester and Colt were better promoted in an age of mass communication? Historic importance should equal value, but that doesn’t seem to be the case with America’s first firearms.         
   I agree that the Sirkin sale hurt the market, as will any sale with too many goodies at one time, but it was certainly not the catalyst for the downtrend in prices. The downward trend seems more complicated to me.
Patrick Hornberger
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Offline Eric Kettenburg

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #42 on: December 11, 2023, 12:25:20 AM »
Very interesting take and quite thought-provoking. 

One thing I would add - the Sirkin sale *imho* did not hurt the market because of too much too fast (the 'fast and furious' Sirkin sale?   ;D ) but rather because it was super-hyped, and then given the hype, many people who may have been ready to spend big as well as many big spenders perhaps ready to really bulk up on a collection etc suddenly got a very, VERY eye opening experience as to just how horribly many of these old guns have been buggered and how equally horribly 'experts' and auction houses over the years had been willing to completely overlook the buggery for a buck.  I have spoken to a number of people who were extremely put off and who I am positive may have otherwise spent a lot of freaking money and kept the ball rolling.

That sale alone now has everyone and his brother giving literally everything the stink eye.
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Offline spgordon

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #43 on: December 11, 2023, 02:56:33 PM »
   Add factors like the failure of the original long rifle organizations to recognize their professed mission and develop marketing plans to promote the historic value of the long rifle (beyond its membership). Example – look at how the American decoy collectors turned a $5.00 piece of wood into a $50,000. folk art collectible. Those collectors worked at getting that result back in the sixties. Most every waterside state in America now has a public decoy museum-we have 3 in Maryland. Where are the American long rifle museums?
Why did icons like Joe Kindig, Jr, Henry Kauffman, and William Renwick not join the KRA, along with museum curators and historians - shouldn’t they have been more enticed?
...

Until 1971 and the famous Historic Society York Show no one credible group was putting on exhibitions to the public. The KRA was just formed, but they called it an exclusive club and never invited the general public into their shows, so they never put on any public exhibitions. There was a long stretch from that York show until 2009 and (forgive me) my exhibit at the Berks County, Reading show – the first sizeable exhibit of long rifles in almost 15 years. Apparently, the American Society of Arms Collectors was never much for public exhibitions, leaving only commercial gun shows as the source for the public’s appreciation of the long rifle.

I agree with all that Patrick posted--and want to add something to these particular points, especially his description of rifle collectors as an "exclusive club" who shield their collections from the public. This issue, in one way or another, has come up a lot over the years on this forum. Among other things, the continued private ownership of most longrifles means that access to them is carefully controlled--and this shapes not just how many (or few) people get to see them but what has been said about them. So few of these objects are in museums, where--as is the case with any other "fine art" (from paintings to decoys)--anybody can inspect them, analyze them, and publish their findings about them. They are difficult to access and the points of access are carefully controlled.

Eric makes the same point, I think, when he notes that "'experts' and auction houses over the years ha[ve] been willing to completely overlook the buggery for a buck." The closed fraternity that sold or traded these objects to one another all had an interest in not saying certain things. Questionable claims, made assertively to an audience who was sure to nod approvingly, settled in as fact. For better or for worse, the days when closed fraternities can "manage" things as they could in the past--before social media, say, or lists such as these--are over.

It's always struck me as extremely odd that the research produced by this field since the 1980s--from the KRA Bulletin to the Moravian Gunmaking Books or other KRF publications--are in so few public or university libraries. It's not surprising, for the reasons I've mentioned above, but it helps guarantee this small, inward-looking audience. We live in a world of open access. I'm thrilled that ASAC has made the contents of its bulletins (before a certain date? I'm not sure) freely accessible on the internet. KRA hasn't. Instead, it keeps this research restricted to an "exclusive club."

I don't think this is the way to build interest in a topic anymore, however it may have worked in the past.
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Offline AZshot

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #44 on: December 11, 2023, 03:25:53 PM »
As a life-long gun collector (45 years) I can relate my perceptions.  The popularity of gun types (or any antique collecible) rises and falls.  I'm relatively new to long rifles, if they've "always gone up" in value, that's unusual, relative to other types.  Two overall trends are here:

1. Gun types that were collectible before are no longer, but some types that were not valuable before are now.  Most of this can be tracked to the decline in hunting guns of all types, and the rise of defensive guns.  For example, it used to be fine hunting shotguns like Parkers and Brownings were very desirable when I was growing up.  Military trench guns or short riot guns were ignored, in favor of a long barreled, finely blued, high grade walnut gun.  Today the Trench shotguns (even fakes) are $3000, but a fine Browning or Fox shotgun sells for about $400.  Same with target guns.  Americans used to revere marksmen, and accuracy mattered.  Colt Woodsmen, High Standards, Winchester 52s, are ALL way down.  But Seecamp and Kimber guns made for concealed carry are becoming hugely expensive. During the buckskinner days when I was young, or the Civil War reenacter days, black powder was very cool and lots of young people got into it.  My first gun was black powder, much to the dismay of my father, who came from the cowboy rennasaince days of the 1950s.  Oh, and Cowboy Action shooting is declining too.  If people want to dress up, they don't want to dress cowboy, they want to dress up tactical, or "tacti-cool." 

2. Americans today aren't interested in early American history.  Not much made in the 1600s to 1800s is as collected as it was 25 years ago.  Or 40 years ago.  From Pewter to Depression Glass, from hit and miss engines to chippendale furniture, all are down in values from highs seen in our lifetimes.  But if we ARE interested in history, it is from WWII on.  Fine finished pre-war Colts are way down.  Rough wartime finished Colt 1911A1s way up.  Victorian and Art Deco are down.  Mid Century Modern are up. 

I've spent a lifetime gun collecting things that were down, not up.  Like stocks, I try to buy low.  I keep my mind on selling high, not that I've ever sold yet.  But I know what is popular and booming, and what people are saying will "always go up!" while rubbing their hot hands together - I avoid.  I quietlty pick things that I think are undervalued but over-quality compared to what others are excitedly looking for.  A few years ago I found I could actually AFFORD long rifles, after being priced out during the 70s, 80s, and 90s.  So now I'm buing a few.  But I don't chase the "best Kentucky makers".  I buy sleepers. Things I find important, not what the MARKET does.  This technique was reinforced by a famous black powder shooter that you may have heard of, in an article he wrote about collecting long ago - Val Forgett.  But I've seen what other big collectors do too, and learned from them. 

In summary, I've seen many fads in gun collecting.  Prices have shot up, peaked, and the bubble has popped on many areas.  Sometimes the bubble is 20 years, sometimes more like 10.  If Longrifles haven't experienced it yet, it may just mean the "peaking period" was longer than for other genres.   
« Last Edit: December 11, 2023, 03:41:18 PM by AZshot »

Offline Eric Kettenburg

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #45 on: December 11, 2023, 06:33:18 PM »
Excellent points Scott.

In any field of research, one would *assume* that the most accurate research and most direct observations will likely be made by those who have no financial stake in the object of subject being discussed.  Because this specific area of collecting has been "closed" and very fraternal for so long, it is clear that an unspecified (by me) amount of available research is jaded.  When you own a specific item, whatever it may be, I think it's human nature to wish to {(at the least) preserve the monetary value of that item if not increase it.  I find it extremely interesting - and expected - that virtually all speculative or hypothetical proffering revolving around these arms virtually always is speculative in favor of something that increases value.

It has also been my experience (just speaking for myself and some others with whom this has been discussed previously) that because the majority of the arms are privately owned, it has generally been considered rude or inconsiderate to challenge/contradict what the owner believes.  This is something of a turn-off to potential collectors who (again, IMHO) may wish for a free and open discussion of something and would prefer not to feel the need to walk on eggshells.

I think going forward, as has been the case for some time now, the most coveted and sought pieces are going to be those which have not been touched and have escaped the loving attentions bestowed upon so many of their unfortunate brethren!
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Offline AZshot

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #46 on: December 11, 2023, 07:51:52 PM »
Yep, that's why my posts on any collectible's future value falling always makes friends and influences people!  I've lost friends over saying something be BOTH collect may go down in value soon.  Then when it proved true, 6-8 years later the guy comes back around and wants to get reacquainted.  We never speak of my proficy again, and just become friends about other topics. 

Offline J.M.Browning

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #47 on: December 11, 2023, 08:28:10 PM »
In my subjective opinion AZshot has explained the atmosphere . I totally agree!
Thank you Boone , Glass with all the contemplate I read with todays (shooter's lightly taken as such) , you keep things simple .

Offline eastwind

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #48 on: December 11, 2023, 08:54:28 PM »
   I’m pleased to see there is some consensus with my comments, but reading it over in the light of a new day I’d like to re-enforce a few comments made by Scott and add some other points.
   Scott talks about the lack of long rifle books/publications in museums, etc. and this is an important failure that should be exposed. The printed word in all forms is clearly getting harder to sell and selling books on any subject to any store today is a real challenge. One of the outstanding experiences I had was selling the book, Masterpieces of the American Long Rifle, the Joe Kindig, Jr, collection – a book I’m not too proud of regarding the text, but a book that was precisely designed to appeal to the general reader of any American cultural artifact. It presented an overview of historic connections to the rifles, quality print/binding, good sources, vintage photos, index, etc., even though it was admittedly a puff piece for the Kindig collection.
    You all know by now, old Joe’s relationship with Henry Dupont in establishing Winterthur, which led me to assume the Winterthur bookstore (a store with an exceptional inventory of books on early American culture), would be a natural outlet for the book. I visited the store manager. Yes, she understood the Kindig connection, but she would have to have the “board” approve the book. I waited with no word for weeks. I called back and was told the board would not approve it for sale. Stunned, I called my friend, the late Bill Dupont (the family still has a say in Winterthur) – and he said he would call them. He did, only to be told the reason was the book was about “guns”. They did not sell the book, even though they displayed some famous long rifles (sold by Kindig) in the next building. It’s time to recognize that the public does not know the difference between a Gonter and a Glock. Who didn't tell them years ago?
   Another surprising reaction in another direction was from the NRA bookstore manager. He (I wont say who), implied they had too many books on “early guns’, but they would “try” 3 copies. Need I say one can’t make a profit selling 3 books at wholesale rates. Very telling about the NRA focus.
   Without beating the already dead horse, has anyone wondered why the KRA annual show gets stuck in one region for years, why some of the KRA satellite shows are not open to the public, or why in the age of cell phones they still don’t allow photography at the annual show?  Or, since the annual show is basically a commercial gun show – why isn’t it open to the public on one of its two days? Are these measures good for the growth of the subject in today's dwindling market of interest and sales? Why do we keep preaching to the aging choir?
 
 And finally, why is there no credible, not-for-profit, national group of collectors, historians, and those of some specific authority acting as a clearing house for historically accurate writing and publication, whose mission is the concentrated research, promotion, and dissemination of information on the earliest handmade firearms (pre-Civil War) – one that is not spread thin by the inclusion of every firearm in our past.   
I won't go on…
Patrick Hornberger
Patrick Hornberger

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Re: Original longrifle prices
« Reply #49 on: December 11, 2023, 09:09:46 PM »
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 And finally, why is there no credible, not-for-profit, national group of collectors, historians, and those of some specific authority acting as a clearing house for historically accurate writing and publication, whose mission is the concentrated research, promotion, and dissemination of information on the earliest handmade firearms (pre-Civil War) – one that is not spread thin by the inclusion of every firearm in our past.   
I won't go on…
Patrick Hornberger

For groups, how about https://americansocietyofarmscollectors.org/

For current publications:
Man at Arms for the Gun and Sword Collector
Muzzleloader magazine
And a few others that are more obscure. 

On the surface, it's a chicken and the egg paradox:

Early arms aren't popular because there isn't much writing about them.
There isn't much writen about early arms because they aren't popular.

But as others have outlined, having more writing is not going to suddenly gather long rifle collectors.  It takes a love of history, not being taught.  It take exciting movies and TV shows that are rarely made.  It takes people looking for official expertise to read, but most spend their time on forums written by "everyone."