Well after years of using hot water,boiling water, warm water with soap, cleaning concoctions with alcohol and Murphy,s, windshield washer fluid, and everything else you can try, I decided yesterday to simplify. Before I left the range I ran down one patch of very diluted ballistol I was using for range patch lube and when I got home just cold tap water and also used a undersized jag with 3 patches on it to fill the grooves and my .58 cleaned up faster than all of the above.