Author Topic: Another Kibler Colonial..... Frizzen annealing & lock Polishing  (Read 4012 times)

Offline davec2

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Another Kibler Colonial..... Frizzen annealing & lock Polishing
« on: December 05, 2019, 02:58:14 AM »
Well.....I need another project like I need a hole in the head, but I just had to order one of Jim's Colonial rifle kits.  It arrived on Monday, snug in its crate and in perfect order.  Of course, I opened the box immediately just to make sure the US Post Office had not worked any of its usual magic on the contents.  All looked to be fine, so I removed all the parts and put them in a closet because I really, really don't have time to work on this anytime soon.

However.....I had an hour today and thought I would try and get the barrel draw filed.  Now right out of the crate, the barrel had the expected tool marks full length along all of the flats....not really deep but significant enough that I thought I might not be able to get all the draw filing done in the hour I had.  In addition, there was some discontinuity in the surfaces near the waist where the barrel was moved in the machine to complete the milling of each flat.  Again, no criticism here, I just thought it would take a little more time in those areas to get the surface discrepancy filed out.

Just for fun, I took out my phone and opened the stop watch function.  I hit the button on the stop watch and started in on one flat.  It went really well and when I finished I reached over and hit the "stop" button.....5 minutes and 35 seconds.  I timed each of the next four flats.....all less than 6 minutes.  All five primary flats draw filed in less than 30 minutes.  It went so quickly and well, I had time to finish up all eight flats...just for kicks.  ;)

One last point of interest....as I was sweeping up the steel filings on the bench and floor I looked over and saw a gram scale on my bench that I use for making detonators for explosive charges.  I weighed the steel filings to see how much metal I had removed......9.8 grams.  So just in case anyone else out there was wondering how much metal you are taking off draw filing a barrel, there is is......right about 1.1 grams for each flat on a 43" barrel.

So, the barrel is now back in the closet and I have returned to doing what I am supposed to be doing.  If I ever get a chance to put this one together, I will post the progress.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2020, 10:00:39 PM by davec2 »
"No man will be a sailor who has contrivance enough to get himself into a jail; for being in a ship is being in a jail, with the chance of being drowned... a man in a jail has more room, better food, and commonly better company."
Dr. Samuel Johnson, 1780

Offline FALout

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial.....just the very start
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2019, 03:07:34 AM »
I thought you might be posting how it only took you 6-1/2 hrs to complete it without finish.  Your a lot faster at draw filing then I am, think it would take me at least twice as long.
Bob

Offline Stoner creek

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2019, 03:51:59 AM »
Yep. I just draw filed one of those barrels today. It went a lot quicker than expected. I didnít time it because I was enjoying my coffee and paying close attention to my border collie but it couldnít have taken much more than an hour. I have the barrel going through the cold brown process now.
 So far I have 9 hours invested in this kit. It should be completed in another 6-8 hours. The only architectural changes that I have made are cheek piece molding and incised toe and forestock molding.
 There is a lot of wood left to work with in the breech, wrist, and toe areas. I think it might be fun some day to dive into that part and make some chips fly.
 The one thing that amazes me about these kits is how well the parts fit. In particular, the entry pipe. All of us who have spent time inletting an entry pipe can agree that this is a challenging and somewhat dreadful game. With the kit You can clean the casting flash off of Jimís entry pipe and simply push it into place. Amazing.
Remember what got us here.

Offline Chowmi

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2019, 04:49:29 AM »
With the kit You can clean the casting flash off of Jimís entry pipe and simply push it into place. Amazing.

Well, well then, you got away easy with it!  I had to spend at least 20-30 seconds squaring up the CNC'd corners on the entry pipe finial inlet.  Talk about work!  :)

Norm
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Chowmi

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Offline G_T

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2019, 07:02:02 AM »
Sounds like you found a pretty good file for the job! The file I've used leaves a super smooth surface but takes me well over an hour to get the job done. What are you using?

Thanks,
Gerald

Offline davec2

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #5 on: December 05, 2019, 08:11:05 AM »


"No man will be a sailor who has contrivance enough to get himself into a jail; for being in a ship is being in a jail, with the chance of being drowned... a man in a jail has more room, better food, and commonly better company."
Dr. Samuel Johnson, 1780

Offline Jim Kibler

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #6 on: December 05, 2019, 06:40:28 PM »
Bahco are good files.  I use them here in the shop. 

Dave.  I figured you would have converted the metal filing weight to an average thickness of material removed!  ;)

The barrels generally look worse than they are.  The milling marks are usually quite shallow.  With a good file and technique, it's not a big job. 

Jason at Rice belt sands his usual barrels, but this doesn't work well for us as it's hard to control dimensions.  In time we may try to develop a way to improve surface finish, but for now drawfiling works pretty well.

All the best,
Jim

Offline BOB HILL

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2019, 07:29:11 PM »
Glad don't have to weigh my filings. I'd never find them in my shop. It's all i can do to find the tools I'm using. Got to clean up sometime.
Bob
South Carolina Lowcountry

Offline davec2

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2019, 09:46:46 PM »
Jim,

The surface finish on the barrels is just fine.  After your comment, I did convert the 1.1 grams of steel removed per flat to a thickness.  Assuming an average flat width of 0.4", a barrel length of 43", and a density for mild steel of 0.2904 lbs / in^3, the 1.1 grams of steel removed per flat to clean up the surface equates to 0.00053" in thickness.  So, on average, the removal of a half a thousandth of an inch of material results in a smooth file finish with no remaining tool marks.  I wouldn't worry about improving the barrel surface finish .....especially if that process would cause you difficulty somewhere else in the manufacturing.  Besides, you really do need to leave us something to do on our end.....sense of ownership / pride of accomplishment and all that ... ;)
"No man will be a sailor who has contrivance enough to get himself into a jail; for being in a ship is being in a jail, with the chance of being drowned... a man in a jail has more room, better food, and commonly better company."
Dr. Samuel Johnson, 1780

Offline Jim Kibler

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2019, 04:01:53 PM »
Neat information, Dave!  That depth of tool marks seems entirely reasonable.  Cool stuff.

Jim

Offline A.Merrill

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2019, 12:56:45 AM »
Where do you find these Bahco files at ?    Al
Alan K. Merrill

Offline Jason C

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2019, 01:34:32 AM »
Where do you find these Bahco files at ?    Al


Lee Valley and/or Amazon

Offline A.Merrill

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #12 on: December 11, 2019, 06:44:01 AM »
 I found that file on ebay.. $13.00 shipped.  Al
Alan K. Merrill

Offline davec2

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... less than 5 hours to assemble !
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2020, 05:08:20 AM »
Since I reported here on just draw filing the barrel, I have resisted doing any more on this excellent kit from Jim Kibler.  I just don't have the time to work on it......However.....last evening, after dinner, I had a free evening.  This kit is so well done that I got all the assembly done in less than 5 hours....including mounting and trimming all the barrel lugs and a fair amount of clean up on all the cast brass parts !!!!  I just wanted to compliment Jim and Katherine again publicly on an outstanding product.























"No man will be a sailor who has contrivance enough to get himself into a jail; for being in a ship is being in a jail, with the chance of being drowned... a man in a jail has more room, better food, and commonly better company."
Dr. Samuel Johnson, 1780

Offline ScottH

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... less than 5 hours to assemble !
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2020, 05:19:19 AM »
Davec2,
Are you thinking you will add car ing to the stock?
Good progress!

Offline davec2

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... less than 5 hours to assemble !
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2020, 05:44:45 AM »
ScottH,

Yes, I will add carving and some engraving.  Not sure how much of each yet, but certainly some.
"No man will be a sailor who has contrivance enough to get himself into a jail; for being in a ship is being in a jail, with the chance of being drowned... a man in a jail has more room, better food, and commonly better company."
Dr. Samuel Johnson, 1780

Offline Jim Kibler

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... less than 5 hours to assemble !
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2020, 05:57:12 PM »
Thanks Dave.  Looks great.  Nice reviews like yours means a lot.

All the best,
Jim

Offline Marcruger

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... less than 5 hours to assemble !
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2020, 01:05:06 AM »
Now that should be some combination when done - Jim's beautiful Colonial kit and Dave's great skill at carving, engraving and finishing.  I suspect I will be envious of the final result.  BTW, I love that fat curl line in front of the patchbox lid.  It really gives the gun character.  God Bless,   Marc

Offline davec2

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... Started some carving
« Reply #18 on: July 02, 2020, 08:21:53 AM »
Well, as you can see from the date of the last post that this rifle has been sitting on the bench since late January.  I'm still not in a position to go all out on this, but over the past few days I decided that I wanted to do a little carving on the stock.  As is usually the case, it is not the carving that takes time, it is trying to decide on what to carve.  So rather than doing anything overly original, I thought I would just use a carving theme from one of Jim's rifles.....after all, the kit is from Jim.....

So I picked a design I liked a lot when I first saw it and I knew it was going to be a tough one to try to mimic....AND IT WAS !!!!  None of these are completely finished yet but I wanted to get the overall design cut.  I will finish smoothing the backgrounds and cleaning up some details when I actually get around to finishing the rifle.....

I started off by putting a molding along the ram rod channel and then thinned out the wrist some side to side and top to bottom.  Did the usual lock molding, etc., but here is the major stuff.....

Butt stock main carving layout:



First Cuts:



Mostly done......



I wanted to change the carving around the rear pipe so, instead of using the original design, I made up a variation on the theme Jim used elsewhere on his rifle......layout of the design.......



And cut......







Breach carving.........





Toughest one of all......patchbox !



"No man will be a sailor who has contrivance enough to get himself into a jail; for being in a ship is being in a jail, with the chance of being drowned... a man in a jail has more room, better food, and commonly better company."
Dr. Samuel Johnson, 1780

Offline James Rogers

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... Started some carving
« Reply #19 on: July 02, 2020, 10:59:26 AM »
Lovely work Dave! I confused Dave's at 3 in the morning but I know who you are!
« Last Edit: July 02, 2020, 02:34:41 PM by James Rogers »

Offline hawkeye

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... Started some carving
« Reply #20 on: July 02, 2020, 01:16:55 PM »
Looks really great, you've done a great job
Awesome!!!!

Offline smart dog

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... Started some carving
« Reply #21 on: July 02, 2020, 02:04:41 PM »
Hi Dave,
Beautiful!  Very strong Kibler influence in the carving. 

James, thanks but you have the wrong Dave.  Too many Daves I guess.

dave
"Flick Lives!"

Offline James Rogers

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... Started some carving
« Reply #22 on: July 02, 2020, 02:33:59 PM »
Hi Dave,
Beautiful!  Very strong Kibler influence in the carving. 

James, thanks but you have the wrong Dave.  Too many Daves I guess.

dave

Dave, you are correct.  I should not post at 3 in the am! I know both of you but evidently not when I'm half asleep!

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... draw filing the barrel
« Reply #23 on: July 02, 2020, 03:12:07 PM »
Glad don't have to weigh my filings. I'd never find them in my shop. It's all i can do to find the tools I'm using. Got to clean up sometime.
Bob

I clean the shop when I have to force the door open but not until. ;D

Bob Roller

Offline BOB HILL

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Re: Another Kibler Colonial..... Started some carving
« Reply #24 on: July 02, 2020, 05:05:39 PM »
Mr. Roller seems like we have more in common than a first name.
Bob
South Carolina Lowcountry